Author Topic: Inteligent design Exposed  (Read 10488 times)

Offline PurpleYouko

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Inteligent design Exposed
« on: November 11, 2005, 10:35:04 AM »
I found the link I was looking for.

I saw this on Good Morning America today.

Quote
VIRGINIA BEACH, Va. Nov 11, 2005 — Religious broadcaster Pat Robertson warned residents of a rural Pennsylvania town Thursday that disaster may strike there because they "voted God out of your city" by ousting school board members who favored teaching intelligent design.

Well there goes any semblence of a distinction between ID and religion.

Assholes like this are the reason that Scientists get so pissed when they try to insert this non-scientific mumbo-jumbo into our science classes.

If ID is a science then why the heck can't they treat it like one?

Propose a theory then test it to death like we do with every other branch of science.
  • Not one jot of evidence has ever been put forward.
  • Not one scientific theory has been proposed.
  • Not one prediction has ever been made based on Inteligent Design theory
  • ID is not falsifiable!
  • ID is Not science. It is at best philosophy but more likely a careful and specific ttempt to circumvent the laws separating church and state.
If we accept this unscientific thinking into our science classes then we might just as well burn all the science books and then go back to teaching Geocentricism and a flat Earth.

ID = Thinly disguised religion. Period.  :angry:

That is why we get pissed off at it.
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Offline Zelos

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« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2005, 11:49:36 AM »
ID is for just a ting we humans have made up to fullfill one of our basic needs. Many think that we humans are so special, its time to realise that we humans aint special, we might be inteligent but that doesnt make us so special. If ID comes into classes then we can just take of out clothes and use a club to club girls down and drag them in their big hairs to our cave.
When I have the eclipse cannon under my control there is nothing that can stop me from ruling the world. And I wont stop there. I will never stop conquering worlds through the universe. All the worlds in the universe will belong to me. All the species in on them will be my slaves. THE ENIRE UNIVERSE WILL BELONG TO ME AND EVERYTHING IN IT :evil: AND THERE IS NOTHING ANYONE OF you CAN DO TO STOP ME. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Offline Numsgil

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« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2005, 12:39:01 PM »
Now now, ad hominem arguments aren't terribly useful.   :rolleyes:

Offline Zelos

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« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2005, 12:50:25 PM »
HU?
When I have the eclipse cannon under my control there is nothing that can stop me from ruling the world. And I wont stop there. I will never stop conquering worlds through the universe. All the worlds in the universe will belong to me. All the species in on them will be my slaves. THE ENIRE UNIVERSE WILL BELONG TO ME AND EVERYTHING IN IT :evil: AND THERE IS NOTHING ANYONE OF you CAN DO TO STOP ME. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Offline Zelos

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« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2005, 01:01:31 PM »
but nums you gotta admit that the entire idea of ID is just ridiculus, comon if someone created all this then who created him? and if he dont need a creator then why does the universe need it?
When I have the eclipse cannon under my control there is nothing that can stop me from ruling the world. And I wont stop there. I will never stop conquering worlds through the universe. All the worlds in the universe will belong to me. All the species in on them will be my slaves. THE ENIRE UNIVERSE WILL BELONG TO ME AND EVERYTHING IN IT :evil: AND THERE IS NOTHING ANYONE OF you CAN DO TO STOP ME. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Offline PurpleYouko

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« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2005, 01:22:20 PM »
my question is simply this.

How is it possible that all life in our universe is the result of an inteligent designer unless that designer is God?

If it was God then it is clearly outside the ralms of science. Period. We can't test God. It is now a matter of faith. If that is what you want to believe then go right ahead. I won't try to stop you. Just stop dressing it up as science and keep it the hell out of our science classes.

If it wasn't God then what? Come up with a good solid hypothesis that doesn't contradict the known facts. Until we have that then I also demand equal time for teaching the theory of the Invisible Pink Unicorn, Sant-claus and the Easter bunny.
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Offline PurpleYouko

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« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2005, 01:39:54 PM »
Have you ever wondered where all the missing socks go?

Let's look at the evidence.

FACT - Almost every time that my wife does my laundry, it comes back with an odd number of socks.
FACT - No matter how hard I search, the missing socks never turn up anywhere in the house.
FACT - The laundry NEVER left the house.

Hypothesis - There are an army of little invisible Gnomes that visit all the houses around the world and steal the odd sock here and there for purposes known only to themselves and to their leader, [drumroll]The Sock King[/drumroll] who presumably makes lovely comfortable underwear out of them.

Prediction based on this hypothesis - At some time in the next few weeks at least one of my socks will mysteriously vanish, leaving its twin sitting sad and alone in my sock drawer.

When my prediction comes true (as it invariably will), am I to use this as a validation of my hypothesis?
When others independently verify my findings as their own socks steadily and mysteriously disappear, do we elevate my hypothesis to the vaunted position of a "Scientific Theory"?

Somehow I seriously doubt that it will become accepted, even though it actually meets many of the requirements.

In actual fact My theory is far stronger than that of Inteligent Design. I have direct evidence. I have made specific predictions based on my hypothesis and they WILL come true. Just you wait and see.

Mark my words. The Sock King will have all your socks in the end  :evil:
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Offline Numsgil

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« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2005, 02:31:01 PM »
The problem is when I suggest an alternative hypothesis:

your socks are being misplaced in the house.

Your evidence supports my hypothesis as well, but I can design an experiment to provide evidence towards mine that discredits yours if I place tracking devices on all the socks.

The idea that a single intelligent designer created all life in the universe is indeed a rather strong, and somewhat absurd claim.

The idea that much of life in the universe was created by intelligence is not anywhere near as strong a claim, and is much less absurd.  In fact, if you believe that there is intelligent life elsewhere in the universe at all, and you don't believe that it's possible that life on Earth was IDed at some point, I'd go so far as to call you a hypocrite.

Back to the sock metaphor, you must construct an idea of what the fossil record would look like for ID, and what it would look like for evolution.  Specifically, how they would look different.

I propose ID would produce evidence that looks like stochastic evolutionary events.  We have some of those in the fossil record.  That doesn't prove that life was IDed,  but it sure makes it look less absurd, doesn't it.

Just so long as you don't believe that the Earth is less than 50 000 years old, you're all right in my book XD
« Last Edit: November 11, 2005, 02:31:18 PM by Numsgil »

Offline PurpleYouko

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« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2005, 03:03:06 PM »
Quote
The idea that much of life in the universe was created by intelligence is not anywhere near as strong a claim, and is much less absurd. In fact, if you believe that there is intelligent life elsewhere in the universe at all, and you don't believe that it's possible that life on Earth was IDed at some point, I'd go so far as to call you a hypocrite.

Again, I have no problem with that concept. It is quite possible that what life there is did not originate on this planet.

I sometimes wonder if we are actually just a colony set up by an alien civilization and they are simply waiting for us to mature enough to be welcomed back into the galactic society. The UFO sighting and stuff are just them checking in on us now and then.  :D

Wonder what the survival rate of colonies is? How many blow themselves to bits before they ever learn their heritage?

Trouble is that this kind of thing is not what IDers claim.

They use arguments like "Irreducable Complexity" and other such crap to prove that all life everywhere was designed by some form of extra-universal inteligence that exists outside oof our time-space.

It would be completely pointless to teach alien genetic engineering in schools as a possible alternative to evolution because that would still mean that evolution is at the heart of life anyway. It just didn't start on Earth.
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Offline PurpleYouko

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« Reply #9 on: November 11, 2005, 03:05:45 PM »
Quote
your socks are being misplaced in the house.
Remember that one of my facts is that the socks are not in the house so this is not a possibility. The house has been searched thoroughly by every means known to man. Besides that, if my socks were being lost in the house, there would be a VERY large cache of them somewhere by now. I must have lost hundreds over the last 10 years.
There are 10 kinds of people in the world
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Offline Numsgil

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« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2005, 03:21:12 PM »
Quote
Quote
The idea that much of life in the universe was created by intelligence is not anywhere near as strong a claim, and is much less absurd. In fact, if you believe that there is intelligent life elsewhere in the universe at all, and you don't believe that it's possible that life on Earth was IDed at some point, I'd go so far as to call you a hypocrite.

Again, I have no problem with that concept. It is quite possible that what life there is did not originate on this planet.

I sometimes wonder if we are actually just a colony set up by an alien civilization and they are simply waiting for us to mature enough to be welcomed back into the galactic society. The UFO sighting and stuff are just them checking in on us now and then.  :D

Wonder what the survival rate of colonies is? How many blow themselves to bits before they ever learn their heritage?

Trouble is that this kind of thing is not what IDers claim.

They use arguments like "Irreducable Complexity" and other such crap to prove that all life everywhere was designed by some form of extra-universal inteligence that exists outside oof our time-space.

It would be completely pointless to teach alien genetic engineering in schools as a possible alternative to evolution because that would still mean that evolution is at the heart of life anyway. It just didn't start on Earth.
That is indeed the sort of arguments I hear from Creationists, and I just shake my head.

But learning that aliens genetically engineered our early life forms is a different story.  It paints a very different picture of the role of evolution (specifically, it's success rate) than the current impression.

Offline Griz

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« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2005, 08:33:33 PM »
MOOT points all ...

the kansas board of education just won the ruling ...
and is now clear to teach ID as part of their science cirruculum in the state.
http://tinyurl.com/cujsg

"This is a great day for education. This is one of the best things that we can do," said board chairman Steve Abrams, who is on record as saying evolutionary theory is incompatible with the Bible's version of God's creation of life on Earth.

that being the case ...
I want to see Pastafarianism taught as well!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_Spaghetti_Monster
« Last Edit: November 11, 2005, 09:32:24 PM by Griz »
不知
~griz~
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Offline Numsgil

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« Reply #12 on: November 11, 2005, 08:51:17 PM »
[grammer police hat]
It's moot point.

Mute points are points made by that pinball wizard from The Who's Rock Opera.
[/grammer police hat]

Offline Griz

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« Reply #13 on: November 11, 2005, 09:30:00 PM »
Quote
[grammer police hat]
It's moot point.

Mute points are points made by that pinball wizard from The Who's Rock Opera.
[/grammer police hat]
I did know that ...
it just somehow snuck, or is it sneaked?,  in there.

must be 'cause of the mute swans I was watching today.

but hey ...
why stop correcting everyone on everything you possible can at this stage, Nums ...
it's out of charactrer and might set a precedent. ;)
« Last Edit: November 11, 2005, 09:33:11 PM by Griz »
不知
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Offline Numsgil

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« Reply #14 on: November 11, 2005, 10:33:31 PM »
Pinball wizard's got such a subtle wrist.   -_-