Author Topic: How is this possible  (Read 2107 times)

Offline Testlund

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How is this possible
« on: March 21, 2006, 08:32:01 PM »
Check out the screenshot. The number of veggies only changed from 203 to 202 over several minutes while the number of bots increases much more rapidly. Where are the bots getting the energy without killing any veggies? The bots I'm using in this sim is R_Fisannis. The veggies don't seem to multiply.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2006, 08:33:21 PM by Testlund »
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Offline Numsgil

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How is this possible
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2006, 08:38:06 PM »
Each other maybe?

In order to tell if they're really manufacturing energy from nothing, we'd need to add some sort of "total energy in the sim" breakdown for bots and veggies, that counts up all the invested energy for both.  If the bots total energy rises faster than the veggies', you know there's a energy source somewhere there shouldn't be.

edit:

one of thr graphs might already do this.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2006, 08:38:33 PM by Numsgil »

Offline Testlund

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How is this possible
« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2006, 08:46:10 PM »
I don't think the bots are canibals. They just floot around shooting randomly. It's strange they get any energy at all. As you can see on the screenshot some veggies have formed colonies with some bots close to them. SOME veggies should die! I can't check out the energy you mension. The graphs are all displaying the same thing, like nothing.
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Offline EricL

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How is this possible
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2006, 08:52:11 PM »
Wait a few minutes with a graph open.  Does it update?
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Offline Testlund

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How is this possible
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2006, 08:58:15 PM »
Ok, here's another screenshot. Can't see the graphs moving at all.
"God is an ever receding pocket of scientific ignorence." - Neil DeGrasse Tyson

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Offline Numsgil

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How is this possible
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2006, 10:00:15 PM »
You have to wait longer.  The graphs only collect data if they're open, and they only update every like 1000 cycles or something like that.

Offline shvarz

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How is this possible
« Reply #6 on: March 22, 2006, 12:30:13 PM »
It is quite possible, in fact it is anavoidable with settings you chose.  You limit veggies population at 200, so they can't divide when there's >200 of them, yet they are still getting enormous amount of energy: 30/veggie=> 6000 energy/cycle are coming into the sim.  So you bots are feeding on all that energy and are multiplying.
"Never underestimate the power of stupid things in big numbers" - Serious Sam

Offline shvarz

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How is this possible
« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2006, 12:32:32 PM »
Actually, it may be even more than 6000/cycle, as you chose 30 energy per kilobody point.  So if veggies you using are storing energy as body, then their energy will grow exponentially.
"Never underestimate the power of stupid things in big numbers" - Serious Sam

Offline Testlund

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How is this possible
« Reply #8 on: March 22, 2006, 12:48:00 PM »
Hmm. Well, I don't understand exactly how the energy system works. How much energy whould you recommend I set for 200 veggies?
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Offline shvarz

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How is this possible
« Reply #9 on: March 22, 2006, 01:06:57 PM »
Well, the energy flow is probably the most important thing for running a good sim, so you should set it right from the very beginning.  There is no general rule as to how much energy you should give a veggie, it really depends on bots and conditions you use.  My rule of thumb is: you gotta see the cycles.  That is you should see veggies' and predators' populations go up and down in smooth cycles.  If you have that - your sim will run for a long time.

So back to your question of what you should do: start decreasing the energy you give them by 5 and let the sim run at each setting for 10-20 thousand cycles.  Whatch the populations and adjust the energy accordingly.
"Never underestimate the power of stupid things in big numbers" - Serious Sam

Offline Testlund

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How is this possible
« Reply #10 on: March 22, 2006, 01:15:09 PM »
Thanks for making that clear. I think I'm getting the hang of it. I have it set to 10 at the moment and it seems to make the sim look better.
"God is an ever receding pocket of scientific ignorence." - Neil DeGrasse Tyson

"God is a kid with an ant farm" - Constantine