Darwinbots Forum
Code center => Bugs and fixes => Topic started by: Testlund on October 19, 2005, 09:11:20 AM
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Adding a picture showing the bug. When I add a bot it is now given a random color. When trying to use custom colors and then click on the bot in the list the draw boxes gets messed up.
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Actually, it looks like whenever I make changes in another tab and go back to the species tab it gets messed up.
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why is the pic all orange?
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Placement boxes... I should probably go dig up Bots' old code for better controls.
Thanks, I'll get onto fixing it.
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Speaking of placement boxes - I noticed they don't scale down when I reduce the size of the sim, so keep an eye on that too.
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why is the pic all orange?
It's because I'm using an autumn desktop theme. :-)
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There are still all sorts of GUI bugs in all sorts of versions. Don't let GUI bugs discourage you. Just think of it as the program's way of saying "don't do that".
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Ok, but right now I have difficulty with running 2.4.1 version because it screws up too much. When the bots moves it looks more like a simple program from Commodore 64. A few bots on the screen just bouncing from edge to edge. :blink:
I'm wondering...Can I have both version 2.36.7 and 2.4.1 in the same folder without it causing conflicts? Haven't tried that yet, but I whould like to be able to switch between them.
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I haven't actually tried it but I see no reason why there would be any kind of conflict. I have every version of DB up to 2.4 all in the same folder.
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When the bots moves it looks more like a simple program from Commodore 64. A few bots on the screen just bouncing from edge to edge.
Darwinbots is not all that visually amazing, if that's what you mean. Compare it to Avida though, and I think we're light years ahead ;)
What is complex is all the DNA interactions and things the bot can do. There's alot of math behind Darwinbots. More so since I started playing in the code ;)
When it gets ported to C++, I plan on doing some amazing OpenGL graphics things. Like bioluminescent bots you can see glow, or translucent bots that you can see their innards, etc.
Ok, but right now I have difficulty with running 2.4.1 version because it screws up too much.
How is it messing up, what settings and bots are you using, etc.
The only thing that will really make a bot "mess up" is if it has very little mass (is really tiny) because then it will think it should move in a particular direction using way more force than it needs to.
I've noticed animal minimalis's children having that problem. They'll sort of vibrate in place when they're trying to eat.
I'll post up an "Animal Minimalis Remixed" version later that fixes this problem.
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I wasn't critizising the graphics of the program, I only ment that when I tried the latest version I started with algea_minimalis and animal_minimalis and the bots behaved like I've never seen before. 1 or 2 was moving in a strait line over the screen bouncing against the edges back and forth, like in one of those old games. :)
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I wasn't critizising the graphics of the program, I only ment that when I tried the latest version I started with algea_minimalis and animal_minimalis and the bots behaved like I've never seen before. 1 or 2 was moving in a strait line over the screen bouncing against the edges back and forth, like in one of those old games. :)
each of these versions uses sysvars 2.21 and there ARE differences ...
that turned out to be the problem when I first tried DB ...
the last one you unzip to the folder will overwrite sysvars with the one
it needs ... so I unzipped, then saved/archived each sysvar to a separate folder ...
then copy the correct one into the program folder depending on what version I run.
it's a pain but then things seem to work.
the sysvar2.21for 2.37.4 has a date of 29may and is 2.35KB
the sysvar2.21 for 2.4 is dated 7 oct and has 2.41kb
there is at least one command added in it ...
can't recall just what right now ...
but the point is ... they are DIFFERENT.
I haven't compared the sysvar2.21 for 2.41 or 2.37.6
when I use the correct one ...
my bots stopped acting so erratically.
that is my experience. ;)
~griz~
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I've tried to put back the sysvars 2.21 from both 2.36.7 and 2.37.4 but it doesn't change anything. The settings on the tabs keeps reset back to 0 if I go to another tab and then go back. Therefor I can't make any settings for the sim. Here's a screenshots what the sim look like with version 2.4.1.
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Maybe it's a settings bug? Something wierd...
Zip your whole Darwinbots folder and email it to me at Numsgil2002@yahoo.com. I'll see exactly what's up.
edit:
Newer sysvars should work with older versions, but not the other way around. Things are usually just added to the sysvars, nothing is ever taken away.
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Ok, I've sent you the folder.
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Alright, I'll let you know later today what the problem seems to be.
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Alright, I've posted a new version that fixes this problem.
You can also just use the "load settings" button in the lower left hand corner. Load "lastexit.set"
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Here is my code just incase you won't find all of it...
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Alright, I've posted a new version that fixes this problem.
You can also just use the "load settings" button in the lower left hand corner. Load "lastexit.set"
I downloaded and tried it out. Still have problems. The settings doesn't get changed when I change them. As soon as I go to another tab and goes back the values looks like before. Also it doesn't work to change the colors and skin of the bots. It changes back by itself as soon as I click on another bot in the specis list or on some other tab. If I just start a simulation without making any settings, just load the Animal_Minimalis 24 Remix and starts the simulation I get a few bots falling down the screen like raindrops, falls down the bottom and reappear at the top. If I add both the above mensioned bot and alge_Minimalis and try to make changes on the varoius tabs and start a sim the program crash, displaying the following: Run-time error '75': Path/File access error.
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Stupid GUI :pokey:
I'll look at it some more, and I'll post 2.4.3 in the morning/later tonight.
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Ok, I'll check it out tomorrow. It's 2:23 am here. Going to bed. Will be back in about 12 hours.
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did you load in a setting?
some of the setting files may call up a bot that you don't have ...
or be looking in a place where it can't find it ...
I have had that happen with 'prewritten' settings ...
where the path on the author's machine is different than mine ...
ie, I have installed in a different partition or that had a special
robot location folder.
just ran 2.42, loaded lastexit.set ...
alga_minimus and the new animal_minimalis2.4 and it worked.
they died out after a bit ..
and when I do a restart, or even start a new sim ...
the animals last about 3 cycles and that's it! ???
but on the first run ... it looked promising.
~griz~
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I've tried both old settings end starting without no setting, just adding the recommended bots for the versions. Doesn't matter.
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well ... I'm going back to 2.36 ...
I can't evolve bots if the physics are gonna keep changing ..
and those versions sorta, kinda work most of the time ...
and the insert and gene activations things work too.
actuall, 2.21 was ok .. I played with that for awhile until
I figured out how to use the correct sysvars witht the others.
~girz~
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I've fixed the settings bug and put 2.4.3 on the FTP.
It all (should) work like a dream now.
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thanks for all the work Num ...
with these latest changes ...
I can at least get it running ...
just haven't checked out much except watching a basic sim.
~griz~
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The thing is most old bots need to be tweaked. You see, smaller bots take alot[ less power to move around with. So if you try driving a small baby bot like it's a panzer tank, I think you can see the sorts of trouble you're going to get into.
Dominator Invincibalis still runs well though, I'm not sure why.
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Simple. Dom Inv is just cooool B)
I don't know what it is about him but something in the DNA just makes him super smooth under just about any conditions.
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Grrr, Numsgil! RRRRRHHH!!! :devil: I'm starting to wonder what the problem really is here. Does it work on your computer? Looks like I'm the only one reporting about the problem. The version 2.4.3 acts the same as the other 2.4 versions. The settings don't stay put!!! ..and I still get the 75 run-time error when trying to run a simulation. If it works on your computer then I think we're overlocking something here. You did mension something in another post about another program that DarwinBots is dependent of, a program that you said might behave differently on different machines. Could that be the culprit?
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2.4.3 works like it should on my computer.
In fact, some long standing GUI errors have been fixed in the process.
What sort of run time errors are you getting? What sorts of settings does it want to pretend to be?
Have you tried loading a settings file and seeing what that does?
Check your max veg population tab. The program looks at that and sees if it's 0. If it is, it assumes upon loading the form that it needs to go load your old settings file. But that should only happen when the form loads, which only happens when you start the sim or exit out of options form using the x in the upper right hand corner than load it back up.
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Oh, and before I forget:
your bots are lying on the bottom of the screen because you had y gravity not set to 0.
Go to the physics tab, open the pulldown menu for gravity, and set it to none.
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Grrr, Numsgil! I'm starting to wonder what the problem really is here. Does it work on your computer? Looks like I'm the only one reporting about the problem. The version 2.4.3 acts the same as the other 2.4 versions. The settings don't stay put!!! ..and I still get the 75 run-time error when trying to run a simulation.
no ... you're not the only one ...
SOME of my setting's return when I upload settings or a sim ...
General for the most part, but not physics, such as gravity, or mutations ...
and the 'starting positions' seem to shift on me in Species ...
I like to alter them for aglae along with gravity ...
keeping them in the upper half or confined to one corner ...
which makes for some variation of environment within the window.
also, the uploaded species, when I load a saved sim ...
are not updated in the 'loaded species' box ...
so if I want to edit, I have to also upload my saved settings.
and ... attempting to load other setting or sims ...
that may have been saved with another version ...
almost always results in a runtime error of some sort ...
either a type mismatch or path error or overflow ...
perhps from an older bot ... who can say? ...
there are too many varialble for me to pin it down.
but basically, unless I set up and save the settings and sim FROM
2.43 ... I run into problems when loading in a sim or settings.
and also the insert box doesn't function ...
which I like to make use of in testing a new bot's affect on a stable population/sim ...
and gene activations don't show either, although I have no use for them yet at this point.
and as Num says ... you may have to go tweak the old bots.
I wonder if as folks do that ... we might upload the bots we get to work
into the beastery under 2.43 or something?
meanwhile ... I go back to 2.36 and 2.37 to play so I don't get too frustrated
at the crashes and loss of sims. ;)
~griz~
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Ok, here's what I did:
1. Uninstalled Darwinbots 2.1 and then deleted the whole folder.
2. Installed Darwinbots 2.1.
3. Unzipped Darwin2.4.3 exe and sysvars2.21.txt into the
DarwinBots folder.
4. Copied the text from the Animal Minimalis 2.4 Remix from the
FTP, created a textfile in the Robots folder named'Animal
Minimalis 2.4 Remix.txt, pasted the copied text into the file and
saved.
5. Started the program and clicked 'Start a new simulation' and
the problems with the GUI are there!
6. Deleted the bots from the Loaded species list, added Animal
Minimalis 2.4 Remix and started a simulation WITHOUT doing any
settings in the GUI. Got a warning message that the NRG for
veggies are 50000 something bla-bla. Clicked Yes and the bots are
falling down the screen like raindrops as I've mensioned before.
7. Quit and restarted again, this time adding Alga_Minimalis and
tried to make changes by changing starting points, skin and
color. The program crashes with run-time error '380'.
The problem is that changes in the GUI doesn't stay put.
Sometimes it crashes when trying make changes on the starting
position. If I manage to start a simulation the bots behave
crazy.
Obviously you have done some changes in the 2.4 versions that
doesn't work on my computer. I think I will stay with version
2.36.7 instead. That version works if I run in normal speed,
limit veggies to 100 and veg NRG to 10. Can't load saved
simulations though. To bad I can't limit the bots though. Have
had as much as 3200 objects slowing down the program to 1
cycles/sec!
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2.43 ...
apparently 'save settings' and 'save sim' does not work ...
at least as far as saving species. [and physics/mutations]
once begun, I can alter/add species but ...
when clicking on 'start new' ... they are not there ...
just whatever was loaded in on the sim ...
be it new sim or saved sim.
now if I use 2.37 to save settings and/or sims ...
then I can load them in with 2.43 ...
realizing of course that the bots that work there ...
are going to act differently ...
and/or give runtime errors.
~griz~
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That's weird, I'll see if I can figure out what's wrong.
Bots falling like raindrops means that you have gravity turned on. I know it's a minor point to your post, but when that happens, you just have to go to physics->turn of gravity.
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sorry num but they are right, 2.4.3 is well buggy. I tried running about 10 different sims with different bots and each one crashed with various different errors in less than 30 seconds. The bots do act really crazy, they seem to stop working after a very short while. I got this error report for one of them I dont know if its usefull.
"Out of Memory. path c:\games\darwinbots\robots\alga_minimalis.txt is not a valid robot"
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*grumbles heavily under breath*
lol.
If anyone wants to download VB6, and run the code from there, that would make finding disgusting errors 100% easier for you and for me.
I can't seem to reproduce the sorts of errors other people are getting. I probably know what not to do, and without even thinking I don't do that.
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I finally reached a point in my database project where I can take a break so I downloaded the source for 2.4.3 and tried running it.
Most of the GUI seems to work OK but a few parts do indeed lose their values when changing tabs. Notably the veggie cooldown and repopulate threshold.
Ran the sim and it started just fine with my existing settings file.
The robots then began to fall down the screen like rain, just as described by testlund.
I double checked and gravity is definitely turned off. After a while, th efirst Veggie repopulate event happened and almost immediately I got an overflow error.
Here is the offending code.
If power > ((rob(n).BODY * 10) / 0.8 + Shell) And Not rob(n).Corpse Then
'shot will continue on past this bot since it wasn't all used up.
'with reduced impact
Shots(t).value = (power - (rob(n).BODY * 10) / 0.8 + Shell) * Shots(t).range / (Shots(t).age * SimOpts.EnergyProp)
Shots(t).nrg = Shots(t).range * (RobSize \ 3)
power = (rob(n).BODY * 10) / 0.8 + Shell
Shots(t).Exist = True
End If
The error is in the line beginning "Shots(t).value =(" but I can't see why since all the individual variables in the code appear to be OK.
This is in the "Releasebod" subroutine.
I will look into it a little more myself but bear in mind this is the first look I've had at the 2.4 code so it might take a while.
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That's weird, I'll see if I can figure out what's wrong.
Bots falling like raindrops means that you have gravity turned on. I know it's a minor point to your post, but when that happens, you just have to go to physics->turn of gravity.
it happened here too ... initially.
now that I have somehow been able to run and save a sim ...
it now defaults to those settings. apparently. I guess. who knows?
another thing I have to keep checking is that the veggies are "blocked" ...
that box never seems to come up checked.
anyway ...
I had the same problems getting even 2.37 to run until I added
that sample defalult.setting thing you showed me.
after that ... I had a chance!
so ...
where does the prog get it's initial default settings from ...
you know ... the very first time one runs it out of the box?
and does it indeed use default.set on startup ...
or what?
I was going to attach a settings that works for me on 2.43 ...
and might work for Testlund as well ...
using Alga_Minimals.txt and your new animials:
which I named Animal_Minimalis2.4.txt ...
but I can see no way to attach or upload files here.
can you point me to how/where to do that ...
or show me where such setting files might already exist?
thanks.
~griz~
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OK here is a breakdown of the calculation
power = 3286
rob(n).body = 49.03042
shell = 0
shots(t).range = 14
shots(t).age = 1
energyprop = 1
Shots(t).value = (power - (rob(n).BODY * 10) / 0.8 + Shell) * Shots(t).range / (Shots(t).age * SimOpts.EnergyProp)
therefore....
shots(t).value = 37423.6765
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another thing I have to keep checking is that the veggies are "blocked" ...
that box never seems to come up checked.
It isn't supposed to. veggies are by default Unblocked since the blocked veggies are unrealistic under most simulation conditions.
where does the prog get it's initial default settings from ...
you know ... the very first time one runs it out of the box?
It loads them in from the "default.set" file which is included with the installation
but I can see no way to attach or upload files here.
At the botom of the window which you use to type in your messages, (just below the post icons) there is a browse button. Click it, select a file from your computer and it will appear as a url in the textbox to the left. Then you just submit the post
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Hmmm, power is obviously too large...
I'll go crack open the body function and take a look inside.
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When you first run a 2.4 version, it loads the settings file from default.set.
Whenever you exit the program properly, it saves your current settings as lastexit.set.
When you start up a 2.4 version, it loads up lastexit.set if it exists.
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Power is set in the same subroutine.
power = Shots(t).value * Shots(t).nrg / (Shots(t).range * (RobSize / 3)) * SimOpts.EnergyProp
shots(t).value = 3288
shots(t).nrg = 559.6519
shots(t).range = 14
robsize = 120
from the above formula....
power =3285.956
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I'll stay tuned to see what you guys come up with. Maybe there's light at the end of the tunnel. ;)
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Debugging one step further, the offending shot was fired by an unevolved Carnatis Orbis and is hitting a normal Alga Minimalis.
I almost always use my Carnatis Orbis as a test subject because he is so good at ferreting out bugs.
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It has just occurred to me that the power of a shot passing through another bot should be decreased but it appears to be increasing.
D'you think it might be some kind of slingshot effect? ;)
Probably not. I expect the formula is screwed up somehow.
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> > another thing I have to keep checking is that the veggies are "blocked" ...
> > that box never seems to come up checked.
> It isn't supposed to. veggies are by default Unblocked since the blocked veggies
> are unrealistic under most simulation conditions.[/QUOTE]
ah ... ok.
for some reason I thought it allowed them to be affected by gravity ...
> > where does the prog get it's initial default settings from ...
> > you know ... the very first time one runs it out of the box?
> It loads them in from the "default.set" file which is included with the installation
ok. then if one were to replace that with a known working .set ...
then that might allow Testlund to load and run a sim.
this is what I had to do with 2.37 ... as the default.set that came with
it didn't function on my computer for whatever reason.
> > but I can see no way to attach or upload files here.
> At the botom of the window which you use to type in your messages,
> (just below the post icons) there is a browse button.
well duh! ;) how did I miss that? :redface:
ok ... here's 2.43_starter.set ...
using "&#\Robots" for location so it should find the path as long as
it is in the same folder ...
and it requires Alga_Minimalis.txt and Animal_Minimalis2.4.txt ...
or an edit of the setting to call the new refix animalmininmlis whatever
one has named it.
this one works for me ...
but not for long ... the new animals lasting about 1100 cycles b4 dying off.
~griz~
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Ok. tried out Griz example above by using the starter set. The only difference is that the program doesn't crash and the alga seems to grow!
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OK this is just weird.
I restrrted the program, made absolutely no adjustments to the options window, just hit the GO button.
Ran perfectly
It should be noted though that the default settings file loads in a value of 3 into the tmpopts.ygravity when the sim is first run using an old settings file.
If you just press go then a working settings file will be created. The next time you run it should be fine if you load that one back in.
Well I managed to run Carnatus Orbis for a long old time without crashing after I commented out the second half of the code that calculates the power left in a shot aftr going through an opponent.
Eventually I decided to have a change so I restarted with Destinatus Preliator. Now we get errors!
I get a subscript out of range error in the "Translocation" routine
If counter >= 1 And counter <= .DnaLen - 1 Then
tempDNA(second) = .DNA(counter)
.DNA(counter).tipo = 0
.DNA(counter).value = 0
second = second + 1
Else
length = length - 1
End If
in line "tempDNA(second) = .DNA(counter)"
Second has a value of 91 at the time
Counter = 568
.DnaLen = 638
This routine is a completely new one to me so I am not even going to try to debug this one just yet.
Interestingly, I thought I had mutations disabled at the time :blink:
Another GUI error is that in the mutations window, it appears to be impossible to turn mutations on or off.
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Ok. tried out Griz example above by using the starter set. The only difference is that the program doesn't crash and the alga seems to grow!
perhaps this is progress? ;)
anyway ...
that is what at least allowed me to get 2.37 and 2.43 to run ...
and now I can at least get 2.37 to save and load settings/sims ...
so think I'll stick with 2.36 for now.
besides, I like having a small amount of gravity ...
and developing bots that can overcome it to reach the 'carrots' help up high.
btw ... even the moon setting from gravity is way to high, imo ...
I would prefer having a slider so I could utilize more subtle differences ...
a vernier control if you will. same for other settings like friction.
how about this idea for a place to stash saved settings users
come up with ... interesting setups ... either here or at the wiki?
~griz~
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Here is a tested settings file that has zero gravity
Just copy this into your "settings" folder and it will overwrite your existing default.set file.
Note this file uses Carnatus Orbis so if you don't have that robot then you will need to download it first from the beastiary.
The path to the robot in this settings file is \\DarwinbotsII\Robots\formula1\Carnatus Orbis.txt
You will need to use this exact path or you will get an error.
It also uses Alga Minimalis from the root Robot directory.
Of course it is always possible to delete all species before running the sim then add your own. The rest of the settings will remain the same. Once you have it running just save the settings file again and it should run every time from then onward.
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btw ... even the moon setting from gravity is way to high, imo ...
I would prefer having a slider so I could utilize more subtle differences ...
a vernier control if you will. same for other settings like friction.
There is one. It is found in the advanced control window under "Y Gravity"
The moon and Earth settings are just presets.
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Hehehe :D
Carnatus orbis gets really fat in V2.4.3
I didn't call him "fat circle" for nothing. :lol:
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Okay, after looking at the settings files, the only thing that should be behaving screwy is the species list window in the first tab. I'm fixing that now...
I've also fixed that power shot thing PY was talking about.
Translocation mutations are by far the trickiest.
There should be a control to turn mutations on/off, and it should be working.
I think you're right Griz, even default gravity is way too high. I'll probably go in and set the range you can use much lower and finer.
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Oh, you can slow the rate of descent of the bots by setting the "big blue field" to either a liquid or a solid and choosing appropriate values for friction or drag.
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The veggie population cap doesn't seem to work either. I have it capped at 25 and I currntly have 367 veggies :D
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DP just crashed Translocate again. Same line as before. This time he was definitely not mutating.
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Tried out PurpleYouko's Default setting. Just starting up a sim whould give the error message that the Cornatus orbis is not a valid robot file. If I DELETE it from the species list and add it myself from the formula folder it works, though the simulation is still crazy. At the bottom it said 9 bots and 10 veggies, when it in fact was 0 veggies. The 9 bots were swimming around like crazy, that's all.
Also, it might be importent to mension that one must spell the name of the robot text file EXACTLY the same as it is in the settings file.
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There seems to be a problem with the robot selection window.
I found that a number of times I would delete one bot then add another, only to find the supposedly deleted bot still in th esim when I restarted it. Other times when I add a bot it says it isn't a valid robot file.
It seems that what you need to do is "delete all" to get rid of unwanted bots then add new ones.
Once you have them, repeatedly select each one in turn to make sure that the right details come up. Go to another tab then return and check them again. If they are still there now then the sim will pretty much always run OK.
Sounds like you have no veggie species in your sim. Add Alga Minimalis again and do as I suggested above. It should run fine.
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Also, it might be importent to mension that one must spell the name of the robot text file EXACTLY the same as it is in the settings file.
Naturally. It IS a file after all.
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Tried out PurpleYouko's Default setting. Just starting up a sim whould give the error message that the Cornatus orbis is not a valid robot file. If I DELETE it from the species list and add it myself from the formula folder it works, though the simulation is still crazy. At the bottom it said 9 bots and 10 veggies, when it in fact was 0 veggies. The 9 bots were swimming around like crazy, that's all.
Also, it might be importent to mension that one must spell the name of the robot text file EXACTLY the same as it is in the settings file.
that's because the path in that setting file is:
"E:\DB Backup\DarwinBotsII\Robots\F1 contenders"
and your's is no doubt different.
so you need to edit the lines that call up the bots to
your own path. lines # 8 and ... #48 I think ...
you'll see them ... just two lines above each robot name.
I find it easiest to simply make it "&#\Robots" ...
then as long as your Robots folder is in DarwinBotsII ...
that should find them.
might I suggest that all those submitting setting files use this convention?
~griz~
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That was why I suggested deleting them and adding new ones. The rest of the settings should be fine. :D
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yeah, that's the quickest way. :)
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Anybody tired corpses lately? I did the other night and they appeared to be violating the sim boundries(non-torroidal). Just kind of floating off into the distance.
Not sure if it's been fixed yet, just wanted to give you a heads up.
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Non-torroidal boundaries are not super enforced. The edges are basically spongy, with bots being flung back off the edge at forces relative to how far inside the edge they are.
There might be something stopping corpses from having all the physics stuff calculated properly, I'll give it a look.
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You might want to enforce it. There's a bit of a problem if the bots can't be "flung" away. I think this was what was happening in the EcoSim. Had a dense semi-fixed MB, that wouldn't let the bots move freely.
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The thing is if I enforce it totally (you cannot go too far that way) then it messes with the basic physics engine. The way it is now bots can bounce off the edges slowly losing momentum after too many bounces. Very realistic.
Usually if a bot seems to have "disappeared" beyond the edge and isn't comming back, what it's done is go may 40 twips into the edge to the point that the edge is forcing it one way and it is forcing itself another... and the two are balanced.
What I may do instead of enforcing it strongly is let the camera wander around a bit out of bounds.
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I've just spent a few hours fixing random GUI issues. I don't think I got them all, but I got quite a few, and all the ones you guys were really :pokey: about.
I'm posting it to the FTP as I type...
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Checked on the corpses and found that they were happily drifting off into the blue. Looked kind of like the old bug where the bots could occasionally escape the area. Same rules seem to apply with corpse waste shots winding up back in the main area.
You can walk the camera outwards by clicking on a bot then slowly zooming in on it every so often. When you zoom in too far just zoom out again and repeat.
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Oh, I forgot to check on that.
Mostly spent some time in the GUI