Topics

31

Off Topic / Playing with VB and DB

« on: February 24, 2006, 02:22:22 AM »

Alright I've got VB Express(free and official...Wow and this is by MicroSoft) up and running and it has happily converted DB into 2005 form... How the heck do you deal with this madness each single time :wacko: DB looks like a diced ham after this wonderful "upgrade" that has gone on :blink:

Anyhow I'll see what I can do with it anyways. I'll be gone for awhile so it'll be a good bit unfortunatly :(

32

The Gene depository / Epigenetics and Viruses

« on: February 14, 2006, 03:43:38 AM »

After talking with Elite about it, I sat down and I finally managed to get bots that  safely have relativly stable random gene transfer.

Managed to find and overcome most of the problems, so far. One of the main ones is that veggies can pick up animal dna and become evil animal plant hybrids. Managed to prevent veggies from using the animal dna with epigenetics. The animals all store a value into 971. Then something like:

20 *.vel sub 2 div .up *971 777 div mult store

is used to prevent all these actions from occuring. A bit modified from what Elite mentioned, but the idea of preventing genes from activating in another bot really helped.

The second major was the reverse of this, animals acquiring plant dna. This led to the bizzare rapid reproduction I'd been seeing in the sims. I switched the plants dna to use basically the same repro gene the animals used and it was no longer a problem. I attempted epigen for plants, but many were dying off too fast to transfer the information(non-reproing plants are not fun).

Yet to be solved:

The worst problem left is caused by how relativly unintelligent the bots' genes are. Normally bots have one maybe two genes per action at most. Now imagine there are some 100 genes many exactly identical... The population would rise normally for awhile then begin to decline, apparently the additional gene costs tacked onto the gene transfer costs, were simply too much and eventually wiped them out. Fortunatly a simple "This location already has a value" dna strand should solve this one. :)

The second major problem, one I never thought of is that smaller genes replicate faster. This led the most useless of genes to gain an ever increasing percentage of the genome. To combat this I think a cyclic virus creator gene is in order, this way no one gene would gain an unfair advantage.

Huge genomes:

I'm planning to add in a "genome too big" deletion gene, keeping the genome down to a random 50 genes.

Alright, all I've got for tonight. Kind of makes me wonder though if real dna tries to keep its secrets to itself similarly. Makes sense that gene transfer might not be such a good thing between competing species.

I want to keep working on the dna some, I'll hopefully have a fully working bot in the next few days.

33

Evolution and Internet Sharing Sims / 2 Bots evolving safely in One Sim

« on: February 07, 2006, 04:31:45 PM »

I think it might be finally possible to have multiple bots competing without destroying one another.

I've been playing around with versions of EvoBot, and have gotten good results since they have a basic cannibot recognition. One sim involving fixed and non-fixed competitors, did decently until the fixed bots killed off the mobile bots(fixed bots lose less nrg finding food and occur in numbers; mobiles can find food fixed bots can not). Veggies also seem like they can be left to evolve safely without fear that via directed evolution they'll wipe out the animals.

I'll keep working on this. When mutating EvoBot has an odd tendency to increase in body size; taking up nrg that would otherwise go towards making new bots. I think it may be some sneaky form of cannibotism, just hard to be sure.

I think the overall trick is to have the two bots equally strong but in different areas, balancing the sim. Very tricky, hopefully I can make it work. :)

34

Bot Tavern / Single Store

« on: February 02, 2006, 03:14:43 AM »

Finally, I always thought it would be possible and now I have the results. B)  Using only one store the bots can do everything they need to. Needless to say I'm proud of this little coding triumph :D

My job actually helped me here. I managed to picture the problem in terms of directing different fluids to different locations and the main problems of using only store became clear. :)

Let me know what you all think.

Code: [Select]

' Single Store
' Name says it all bot can reproduce, eat, move, and spin only using one storage location

cond
start
' zero's just in case
50 *50 sgn mult dec
51 *51 sgn mult dec
52 *52 sgn mult dec
53 *53 sgn mult dec

'Repro
50 *.nrg 5000 sub sgn sqr mult 40 *.eye5 sub sgn sqr mult inc

'Shoot
51 *.eye5 35 sub sgn sqr mult *.refeye *.myeye sub sgn abs mult
*50 sgn 1 sub -1 mult mult inc

'move
52 *.eye5 sgn *.refeye *.myeye sub dup div mult mult
*51 sgn 1 sub -1 mult mult inc

'spin
53
*.eye5 sgn
*.refeye *.myeye sub dup div
1 sub -1 mult mult
*.eye5 sgn 1 sub -1 mult add dup div mult
*52 sgn 1 sub -1 mult mult *50 sgn 1 sub -1 mult mult inc

' Here's the single store
314 rnd *53 mult 20 *.vel sub 2 div *52 mult -1 *51 mult 50 *50 mult add add add
.aimdx *53 mult .up *52 mult .shoot *51 mult .repro *50 mult add add add
store

'Testing Dna
'*50 1000 mult *51 100 mult *52 10 mult *53 add add add 70 store

' below should zero all
50 *50 sgn mult dec
51 *51 sgn mult dec
52 *52 sgn mult dec
53 *53 sgn mult dec

stop
end

35

Interesting behaviour bots / Single Store

« on: February 02, 2006, 03:05:54 AM »

' Single Store
' Name says it all bot can reproduce, eat, move, and spin only using one store command

cond
start
' zero's just in case
50 *50 sgn mult dec
51 *51 sgn mult dec
52 *52 sgn mult dec
53 *53 sgn mult dec

'Repro
50 *.nrg 5000 sub sgn sqr mult 40 *.eye5 sub sgn sqr mult inc

'Shoot
51 *.eye5 35 sub sgn sqr mult *.refeye *.myeye sub sgn abs mult
*50 sgn 1 sub -1 mult mult inc

'move
52 *.eye5 sgn *.refeye *.myeye sub dup div mult mult
*51 sgn 1 sub -1 mult mult inc

'spin
53
*.eye5 sgn
*.refeye *.myeye sub dup div
1 sub -1 mult mult
*.eye5 sgn 1 sub -1 mult add dup div mult
*52 sgn 1 sub -1 mult mult *50 sgn 1 sub -1 mult mult inc

' Here's the single store
314 rnd *53 mult 20 *.vel sub 2 div *52 mult -1 *51 mult 50 *50 mult add add add
.aimdx *53 mult .up *52 mult .shoot *51 mult .repro *50 mult add add add
store

'Testing Dna
'*50 1000 mult *51 100 mult *52 10 mult *53 add add add 70 store

' below should zero all
50 *50 sgn mult dec
51 *51 sgn mult dec
52 *52 sgn mult dec
53 *53 sgn mult dec

stop
end

36

DNA - General / Multiple shots?

« on: January 25, 2006, 02:44:56 AM »

Been meaning to ask what happens if a bot gets hit by multiple shots at once. Do they all affect the bot or are they each treated seperately?

37

Mutations / EvoBot5.4StemA

« on: January 23, 2006, 03:33:32 AM »

' Uses poison to id cannibot kin
' Incredibly impressive in its ability to live peacefully at high population levels
' Some of the genes are probably not strictly necessary
' but have been left in for the novelty

start
1 rnd .fixpos mult inc
.delgene inc
stop

cond
start
'.fixpos *.fixed mult dec
50 .sharenrg *.multi mult store
*.eye5 dup sub dec
stop

cond
*.nrg 5000 >
start
50 .repro store
stop

cond
*.robage 0 =
start
.out1 .ploc store
777 .out1 store
stop

cond
*.eye5 0 >
*.out1 *.in1 = and
*.eye5 0 = or
start
314 rnd .aimdx store
'20 3 rnd 1 add *.hitup *.hitdn add *.hitdx *.hitsx add add sgn mult *.fixed 1 sub -1 mult mult store
20 3 rnd 1 add *.hit mult *.fixed 1 sub -1 mult mult *.numties 1000 mult add store
stop

cond
start
*.refxpos *.refypos angle .setaim *.eye5 sgn mult store
stop

cond
*.out1 *.in1 !=
*.aimdx 0 =
*.eye5 30 >
start
*.refnrg 10 mult *.refbody sub sgn 1 add 2 div -5 mult 1 sub
.shoot store
stop

cond
*.nrg 1010 >
'*.body 100 <
start
100 *.body sub .strbody store
stop

cond
*.nrg 200 <
*.body 20 >
start
10 .fdbody store
stop

cond
*.vel 20 <
*.out1 *.in1 !=
*.eye5 0 >
*.fixed 0 =
start
20 *.vel sub 2 div .up store
stop

cond
*.poison 200 <
*.nrg 500 >
start
200 *.poison sub .mkpoison store
stop

cond
start
20 3 rnd 1 add *.edge mult *.eye5 dup div 1 sub -1 mult mult *.fixed 1 sub -1 mult mult store
.hit *.hit mult dec
stop

end

38

Bot Tavern / Evo Anyone?

« on: January 09, 2006, 09:59:20 PM »

Anyone been up to anything lately? Seems like this place has been pretty empty.

Made a semi-fixed bot, that temporarily unfixes when hit. Very odd chain effect a whole mass of bots slowly moving downwards(grav sim) together, when a veggie lands on top of them. Pretty interesting since the fixers deform into a cup like shape, perfect for feeding. It also happily solves the problem of bots building up at edges, since they tend to space themselves out.

I've been trying out different techniques also, had some luck with simply doubling the dna, forming something like introns. Got the idea from an article that mentioned adding them to GA's, allowing for faster evolution.

39

Off Topic / Math question anti-mod?

« on: December 26, 2005, 01:22:27 AM »

Is it possible to determine the anti-mod of a number. That is from a remainder and a number, determine the other number?

I can't quite put it in words but I feel like it'd be very useful. It probably exists already I'm just not finding much about it.

40

Off Topic / Edit Plus

« on: December 21, 2005, 11:55:52 PM »

Editplus

Found this interesting link, looks like it's relativly easy to add custom syntax for it to read. I'll take a look some more later. I'm kinda away from home(vacation horray!) so the laptop is not on hand.

No free wireless acess here, what's wrong with the world.

Edit:

Oh yeah it's shareware so it's more or less free.

Very nice indeed. Allows customizable autotext, cliptext windows, syntax files, and keystroke recording. Best of all, the custom files we create can be stored on their site. :)

41

Bot Tavern / MutBot

« on: December 19, 2005, 03:01:46 AM »

I was working on the idea of having a cannibot and normal altruistic bot combined in one package and instead wound up with the cannibot also being a true carnivore(MutBot in Starting Gate).

While I didn't intend on making the canni form only able to eat and hunt it's own species, it has seemed to make decent predator-prey cycles form. The carni-canni's need the altruists for food and the altruists need the cannis to defend against true canni threats.

Code: [Select]

cond
*.robage 1 =
start
1 rnd *.myeye 50 store
stop
Thisgene here is the main attraction, causing an approximatly 50/50 split between a given offspring being a canni-carni or altruist.

I've still got the simulation going, the latest mutations being repro nrg level increases, continual acceleration, and a continual shot mod, allowing a canni-norm phenotype(which is ironically more or less what I originally intended). The most gratifying effect is that none of the surviving lines haven't broken the altruist/canni gene, hopefully meaning the flexability is extremly useful to the bots.

42

EcoSim Bots / MutBot (Eco)(Endy)-19.12.05

« on: December 19, 2005, 02:43:11 AM »

' Mutbot
' Combines normal herbivore and Cannibalistic Carnivore in one package

cond
*.robage 1 =
start
*.myeye 1 rnd mult 50 store
stop

cond
*.eye5 0 >
*.refeye *50 =
start
314 rnd .aimdx addstore
stop

cond
*.eye5 0 =
start
314 rnd .aimdx addstore
stop

cond
*.refeye *50 !=
*.eye5 37 >
start
-1 .shoot addstore
'.tie inc
stop

cond
*.nrg 5000 >
start
50 .repro addstore
stop

cond
start
*.tiepres .deltie *.tiepres sgn mult store
stop

cond
*.vel 20 <
*.eye5 0 >
*.refeye *50 !=
start
20 *.vel sub 2 div .up addstore
stop
end

43

Biology / Aritcle about lineages and altruism

« on: December 19, 2005, 01:07:55 AM »

Article

Good article about evolution's relation to overall lineages of a species and not a single member. I found the discussion of the value of more flexible genes particullarly interesting. Also has some interesting points about the bennefits and problems with altruistic and nonaltruistic species.

The results in DB from almost any sim seem to generally agree with what the article is saying about altrists. Our normally altruistic bots are "kind" to supposed kin, allowing them to reach massive populations, at the expense to individuals in life span. The nonaltruistic Canni's bennefit their own life spans at the expense of population sizes.

Makes me wonder if perhaps a canni and and altruist combined phenotype bot would perhaps balance the two.

44

Suggestions / Tieports

« on: November 26, 2005, 05:42:20 PM »

Another topic got me started thinking about these again, and ways they could be better :)  I was wondering if perhaps tielenX/tieangX could also readback the current length of that particular tie. That way the bots could know which tieport was activated and various basic information about it.

Something like:

Code: [Select]

cond
*.tielen1 0 !=
start
300 .tielen1 store
stop
would be really useful.

45

Bot Tavern / Evolution Talk

« on: November 24, 2005, 02:32:23 AM »

Just wanted to talk about a couple bots I've been working on with good sucesses in different Evosims.

Mutie uses basic poison recognition to decide wether to feed or not. It also sets ploc to eye5. This has the combined benneficial effects of hurting canni's by blinding them and for more normal brethern it tells them to turn after they've been feeding from a veggie.

ReproVeggie
 is a somewhat Cancerous Veggie that reproduces at the maximum level 99%. This makes it both extremly good at surviving predation by essentially sacrificing the weak parent(possibly being eaten) to produce a strong child with better chances at escaping the attack.

I've finally had a truly decent sim that hasn't gotten stuck, at either extreme with these two, so I'm pretty proud of them. :)

P.S.
Oh yeah, I'm back...until next week, then I'm gone again for a few. :sad2:
Oh well, I live in the hopes that our longer underway's will be cooler seeing other countries and all. :)