Author Topic: Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled  (Read 9514 times)

Offline Ta-183

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Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled
« Reply #15 on: October 29, 2009, 06:32:27 PM »
Yeah. I can't really remember how many zeroes I had in them, but I usually ran around 100 bots for the seeding rounds, then I think around 50 after that. I can't remember. But it takes an assload of patience and luck to get anything out of them.

Offline ikke

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Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled
« Reply #16 on: October 30, 2009, 03:24:17 AM »
I used 100 bots with 1000 BP of random numbers (excel generated) to start an evo sim. Reproduction occurred after 1 M cycles. I started with veggies, no ageing cost. Added ageing cost when the pop had doubled (mass extinction of course). I started a new sim with the evolved bots as predators when they developed feeding (shooting IIRC).

|EDIT: looked up the thread: memory is definitly faulty:
evo sim thread

this post may also give some info w/r evo sims:
my first evo sim
« Last Edit: October 30, 2009, 03:46:18 AM by ikke »

Offline Drognan

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Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled
« Reply #17 on: October 30, 2009, 02:45:01 PM »
Inserted some 1000bp zerobots, enabled dynamic costs, target pop. around 140, and now will wait.... Eh, now It's 23M cycles, no repro...    

Offline ikke

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Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled
« Reply #18 on: November 01, 2009, 02:45:57 AM »
save the sim and post it. I'd like to check the settings.

Offline Drognan

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Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled
« Reply #19 on: November 08, 2009, 05:43:08 PM »
There is problem with uploading sim (web page not accesible), I'll try in few days

Offline Numsgil

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Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled
« Reply #20 on: November 09, 2009, 04:13:20 AM »
You mean you can't upload things on posts?  Is it a large sim?  Have you tried zipping it?

Offline Drognan

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Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled
« Reply #21 on: November 12, 2009, 06:40:56 AM »
OK , posted two sims. First I ran, but lost patience and started another. Same settings, but no reproduction... I don't beleive that there was an evolutionary dead end in oth simulations...

Offline ikke

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Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled
« Reply #22 on: November 14, 2009, 01:50:59 AM »
I am unable to unzip these files with winrar. What program have you used?

Offline Drognan

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Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled
« Reply #23 on: November 16, 2009, 06:03:38 AM »
winzip

Offline Drognan

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« Reply #24 on: November 17, 2009, 02:23:36 AM »
OK started new sim, animal minimalis and alga minimalis. I'll gradually decrease bang efficiency. Maybe it's better starting point...
Thank you guys for all help... I'll keep you informed about progress

Offline Drognan

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« Reply #25 on: November 17, 2009, 03:41:25 AM »
Quote from: Numsgil
You mean you can't upload things on posts?  Is it a large sim?  Have you tried zipping it?

OK here are simulations. Compressed in Winrar.

Offline Moonfisher

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Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled
« Reply #26 on: November 17, 2009, 02:25:47 PM »
LOL, I remember when winzip was the norm and noone knew what winrar was

Offline ikke

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Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled
« Reply #27 on: November 18, 2009, 02:20:05 AM »
arj anyone?
On topic: No obvious (to me) errors. Lot if settings I never used though. Nice trick to use the transporter to keep movement in the sim. Point mutations are set high. You'll want to bring that down once something is going, but to clear the zeroes it is OK. I never use oscillation for mutation rates, but at this stage it doesn't matter. There is a shooter you may want to re seed in a new sim, but you may consider that cheating. No clear reason why repro cannot evolve.
Warning: increase in ageing cost is way too high. If something ever gets going you'll probably wipe out all life in a heartbeat.
The sim I recently posted had 100 1000 BP zerobots. Once point mutations transformed the 0's into random I brought the point mutation rate to it's current setting (default x10) and set the mutation rate to 1/32. repro within 2M cycles.
Sorry I can't be of more help

Offline Drognan

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« Reply #28 on: November 19, 2009, 03:56:41 AM »
Thank You for suggestions... Oscilations for mutation rates is more biological. If you look at our own past, there are periods of stable ecosystems that lasts for thousand (milions) of years and then happens some radiation, polution, or natural disaster that causes lots of mutations. Then again is period of stability that enables natural selection of newformed biodiversity. That cycle repeats on and on and will probably repeat again... With short period of 16x mutation rate I get lots of mutations and then with long period of 0.16x mutation rates I get natural selection.
However I gave up of my zerobots, now is new simulation in progress, animal minimalis and alga minimalis. I gradually decrease movement efficiency, right now bang efficiency is around 10%, zero momentum on. I'll post sim when bang efficiency drops to zero

Offline Numsgil

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Zerobot evolution with voluntary movement disabled
« Reply #29 on: November 19, 2009, 01:04:23 PM »
Quote from: Drognan
Thank You for suggestions... Oscilations for mutation rates is more biological. If you look at our own past, there are periods of stable ecosystems that lasts for thousand (milions) of years and then happens some radiation, polution, or natural disaster that causes lots of mutations. Then again is period of stability that enables natural selection of newformed biodiversity. That cycle repeats on and on and will probably repeat again... With short period of 16x mutation rate I get lots of mutations and then with long period of 0.16x mutation rates I get natural selection.

There was some discussion about this sort of thing years ago.  I had your reasoning, and I think shvarz favored constant low level mutations.  I'm not sure if there's any strong evidence either way.  Which one you favor probably goes more to which version of evolution you hold internally (stochastic vs. gradual).

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However I gave up of my zerobots, now is new simulation in progress, animal minimalis and alga minimalis. I gradually decrease movement efficiency, right now bang efficiency is around 10%, zero momentum on. I'll post sim when bang efficiency drops to zero

You might also try something like enitor comesum (see: my old old sim).