Internet mode as default

[shvarz]

I think it would be very helpful to make new installs to default to internet mode. The new user would start the program and get a list of current (or recent) sims on the internet. He would then choose to "Join sim", which would download all the settings for him, plus several bots and start the sim. No need to figure out how DB works, instant gratification, instant fun and feeling of being in a community.

Once we get that, I'd be happy to promote DB (again) on my blog, which is regularly read by ~100-200 people, many of them scientists and programmers.

[EricL]

I'm totally with you.  I will work torwards this.

[Peter]

I disagree if the program inmidiates trys to connect without any warning, I would block with my firewall  anything that I've just got and and if I am not fully sure for what purpose it is connecting. And if a program takes a action like that it will be one step closer to the recyle bin.

I agree if there is atleast a notification that there will be a connection before it connects. And whatfore and a little description.

Overal I would set the internet sim at the same place as start sim, maybe some promotion of it if the program starts.(something like the explain image I saw on earlier versions of darwinbots)

[EricL]

You've already put your trust completly in my hands when you download and execute an unsigned EXE as a local admin.  I could easily delete everything your C drive without ever connecting to the internet.  So the argument that providing the newbie user with some choice about entering IM is a security thing is total bunk.  They made their choice to trust us when they ran the install.    If they get scared by the firewall pop-up, fine, they don't have to poke a whole through their firewall if they don't want to.

[Testlund]

There is a risk if some hacker out there sniffs this up and want to exploit it. I just hope Internet mode can only transfer bot data and not any data. But with good security programs it should be easy to discover if something bad is going on. My firewall tells me exactly what files are being used in internet mode.

[shvarz]

I just tried 2.43r and on load it immediately started asking me to load up a bunch of bots that I did not have (Martian tank etc). Hitting cancel helped, but it was a bit annoying. I assume the program hooked up to internet, because some bots appeared and a sim got started.  I could not open any internet-mode graphs (species or sims populations). The new "internet" icon had a green and red computers. I clicked on it, got "error 5" and program froze.

[Peter]

You've got a point there.
Note to myself, don't run darwinbots anymore if I am admin. Don't even run it if I am at win 2000 or below.
It is dangerous how easy it is to destroy a computer that way, correct.

Just, a introduction about what IM is and does is enough, with programs inmidiatly connecting to internet at startup I just wonder 'what is it doing' most times I know it is not dangerous as most programs I have are signed. I just don't fully like the idea of a connection inmidiatly to the internet after startup.

But okay it is fine by me eather way I don't care that much.

[Testlund]

I clicked on it, got "error 5" and program froze.

Yay! Another one! I'm not alone!  

[Numsgil]

What OS are you guys running.  I'll bet dollars to donuts it's another Vista issue.

-----------------------

Eric's got a strong point.  Darwinbots doesn't come with a warranty.  There's no guarentee that it won't render your OS unbootable (there are lots of ways to break windows just by editing a few lines of code in notepad).  Of course, there's a certain level of trust going on here.  Most of the world works like this.  It wouldn't be too hard for a malicious person to cause all sorts of havok in real life, too.  It's really amazing how trustworthy humanity is as  a whole.

Anyway, back on topic, when you first run the Darwinbots .exe, you're all ready signing yourself over to the DB developers heart and soul.  Firewall issues are the least of your worries.

[shvarz]

I have WinXP Pro. I just went through the whole thing again and it crashed again. Internet mode used to work fine for me.

BTW, it's not a complete crash - program stays open, menus work, buttons get clicked and so on, but nothing else is happening.

[Numsgil]

Maybe it's a Visual Basic driver issue somehow.  Or a regional setting messing something up?  I've done Darwinbots on a fresh XP install about a month ago.  The only issue I had was a missing .ocx file.  Other than that, everything ran just fine.

[Peter]

There is a risk if some hacker out there sniffs this up and want to exploit it. I just hope Internet mode can only transfer bot data and not any data. But with good security programs it should be easy to discover if something bad is going on. My firewall tells me exactly what files are being used in internet mode.

Exactly what security programs are you useing that can see everything. Looks kinda special to me, for example I was going to play some game with a friend of mine thought the internet(friend lives in other town), he first had to install the game, after a while I asked if it was done, yes, almost right now just downloading scenario files from your computer.
First reaction, wh.. what, what are you doing, ho..., how.

To explain, I've got some VPN-program running, the VPN tunnels to most simple firewalls(well I had standard XP), the scenario-file was a shared file, simply becouse on local network that was the simpelest way to get desame scenarios, from there it is really childs-play.
And you want to say yours can see all that, seems spectaculair, too becouse there can be given something to the program who is going further with the data. A newer firewall gave a little notice when trying to connect, but serious exactly where and how and what the program is doing seems awful lot of data.

[Testlund]

Eric's got a strong point. Darwinbots doesn't come with a warranty. There's no guarentee that it won't render your OS unbootable (there are lots of ways to break windows just by editing a few lines of code in notepad). Of course, there's a certain level of trust going on here...

I have no reason to distrust the makers of DB. After 2 years in this community I feel secured you don't want to ruin everything by hacking peoples computers. It's about the possiblility for others to exploit it I think about.

Exactly what security programs are you useing that can see everything...

I'm using Comodo Firewall Pro. A freeware firewall you can get here: http://www.comodo.com/
They also have an antimalware aplication called BoClean, also for free.
When the firewall pops up about an application I can click to see what files it gets hooked into. Though this is a very good firewall it has some issues with popups for application when they use windows services, which can cause your internet access to get blocked if you block the application. I get around it by having those applications closed when I want to surf.

[shvarz]

Maybe it's a Visual Basic driver issue somehow. Or a regional setting messing something up?

I don't think so.  I just tried it again and I found a way to make not crash. Went through the whole "Give me million of these non-existing bots" routine, sim got started, internet icon had red and green computers. Then I manually loaded up one of my older sims. Clicking on internet icon, internet got turned off. Clicked on it again and now it's all fine and dandy. So, it's not VB or other stuff, it's something about the way the program loads the very first sim during startup.

[Peter]

Exactly what security programs are you useing that can see everything...

I'm using Comodo Firewall Pro. A freeware firewall you can get here: http://www.comodo.com/
They also have an antimalware aplication called BoClean, also for free.
When the firewall pops up about an application I can click to see what files it gets hooked into. Though this is a very good firewall it has some issues with popups for application when they use windows services, which can cause your internet access to get blocked if you block the application. I get around it by having those applications closed when I want to surf.

Thanks for the link, the behaviour you descripe reminds me a little of kaparsky firewall, it wanted to block anything(click on this computer(and you get a do you want to block signal), I am not sure if I could blame it on it, but becouse of it IE didn't work properly anymore, shuting suddenly down. After that I looked for another browser and well I am not going back to IE.  This one is better. Some bad things give in the end good things.