Author Topic: God doesn't play dice  (Read 20321 times)

Offline Numsgil

  • Administrator
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 7725
    • View Profile
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #45 on: March 16, 2005, 03:13:16 PM »
Sarcasm aside... :rolleyes:

Sin and Cos are the only things missing that would allow you to do this kind of thing.  And if you know the angle you want to go in terms of x,y components you can do it in 2.35 no problem.

Offline PurpleYouko

  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 2556
    • View Profile
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #46 on: March 16, 2005, 03:30:45 PM »
But sarcasm is the best part of it.

I just want to know what would be the point of accelerating off to some angle that you aren't looking at. You might just run into a predator or a brick wall or anything really.

This kind of behaviour would almost certainly be weeded out as inefficient by evolution anyway even if it were added to the DNA language.

I would also like to know what kind of rocket propulsion system on a space vehicle, would be able to make this kind of maneouvre anyway. This is unrealistic in DBs or in spacecraft since rocket motors tend to be fixed in relationship to the rocket bearing them. Small thrusters may be able to rotate a little bit but not to face in every conceivable direction.

 :D  PY  :D
There are 10 kinds of people in the world
Those who understand binary.
and those who don't

:D PY :D

Offline Numsgil

  • Administrator
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 7725
    • View Profile
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #47 on: March 16, 2005, 03:34:21 PM »
Hey, Bots proposed the problem.  I'm just showing how it'd work in the current system.

I have no idea what possible use it'd be.

It could be that you want to move towards something like you do in FPS, by strafing.  That way you can check your back as you move towards a food source.

Still, there are better ways to do it.

Offline PurpleYouko

  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 2556
    • View Profile
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #48 on: March 16, 2005, 03:44:31 PM »
Quote
Still, there are better ways to do it.

Right like moving forward while shooting at an angle. Now that is an idea that I like.

 :D  PY  :D
There are 10 kinds of people in the world
Those who understand binary.
and those who don't

:D PY :D

Offline Numsgil

  • Administrator
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 7725
    • View Profile
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #49 on: March 16, 2005, 03:50:08 PM »
That's where .aimshoot comes in.  Definately has some fun possibilities.

Offline Botsareus

  • Society makes it all backwards - there is a good reason for that
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 4483
    • View Profile
    • DJ Paul Kononov
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #50 on: March 16, 2005, 03:50:49 PM »
yea strafing...

***

 add Sin and Cos Num , not a bad idea at all. (There are more uses like my lessbeef bot)

Ill figure the rest out myself.

***

Also in the current system a robot set to go at 10 (10 .up store) will instantly reach speed 10 and go on speed 10.

My Idea is:

Lets say the speed limit (absolute vilosity) is 100

Each cycle a robot fires a booster at 1 .up store that means it will take say 300 sycles to reach speed limit (speed 100).

If Each cycle a robot fires a booster at 10 .up store that means it will take say 30 sycles to reach speed limit (speed 100).

If [you]skip 1 cycle [/you]a robot fires a booster at 10 .up store that means it will take say 60 sycles to reach speed limit (speed 100).

A non-liner curve will look even better , I posted an example of one before in this tread as a picture.

The speed will gradualy increase until it reaches 100.

(I do however notice this when alga gets hit by a moving robot, It gradualy decelerates; Not instantaneously)

Offline Numsgil

  • Administrator
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 7725
    • View Profile
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #51 on: March 16, 2005, 04:10:44 PM »
Okay, say you store 2 in up.

First this impulse is scaled back by the movement factor in the physics page.  The default is .8, which means you must multiply 2 by .8, which gives you 1.6

Next, this acceleration is divided by mass.  Mass = 0.5 + (.body / 10000) + (.Shell / 200).

Then it's applied to the bot.

If a bot is moving, friction acts on it, slowing it down by percentages each cycle.

Offline Botsareus

  • Society makes it all backwards - there is a good reason for that
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 4483
    • View Profile
    • DJ Paul Kononov
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #52 on: March 16, 2005, 04:24:40 PM »
If that Acceleration is notisable by the user abserving the simulation then I like it.

***
Will be nice if you add Sin and Cos as well.

***
Getting back to shvartz idea: Shvartz what do you want to have happen when a moving bot hits a stationary bot. I think some pool play is great.

 If we make a seporate system for the kind of motion you prepose then [you]hitting something will simply slow[/you] it down is a good idea under your rules shvartz.

But the rules of my seporate system playing some pool is still on.

I think making both types of movement systems available for the bot is a good idea.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2005, 04:28:41 PM by Botsareus »

Offline Botsareus

  • Society makes it all backwards - there is a good reason for that
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 4483
    • View Profile
    • DJ Paul Kononov
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #53 on: March 16, 2005, 04:35:16 PM »
Num, your lest post was an idea or how db works now?
« Last Edit: March 16, 2005, 04:35:29 PM by Botsareus »

Offline Numsgil

  • Administrator
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 7725
    • View Profile
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #54 on: March 16, 2005, 04:35:36 PM »
Without momentum colision has no meaning.  Bots move just enough so they aren't overlapping then stop.

Bots, that last post is how it works now.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2005, 04:36:00 PM by Numsgil »

Offline Botsareus

  • Society makes it all backwards - there is a good reason for that
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 4483
    • View Profile
    • DJ Paul Kononov
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #55 on: March 16, 2005, 04:41:59 PM »
Well I have talked about another collision method that works without momentum. The friction increase for each bot being "dragged" method.
Basicaly with each new bot being pushed the speed is / 2
If you push 4 more bots your speed is "speed / 16"
(I am using it in PusherBots.vbp , works great) Do you like this collision method shvartz?

***
Well Num if that is supposed to be Acceleration, (forgive the languge) it sure sux. Maybe I am doing somthing wrong with the settings? I dont see no acceleration...
« Last Edit: March 16, 2005, 04:42:31 PM by Botsareus »

Offline Numsgil

  • Administrator
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 7725
    • View Profile
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #56 on: March 16, 2005, 04:48:48 PM »
What do you mean you see no acceleration?  You mean in the algorithm I posted or when you have number .up store?

My thinking: I'm going to see if I can rework how friction is handled.  If it's applied and then new accelerations happen, we can have an absolute friction sim without it immobilizing the bots.

Hey Bots, post your pusherbots code in another thread in the general board.  I'm sure we'd all love to look at it.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2005, 04:49:24 PM by Numsgil »

Offline Botsareus

  • Society makes it all backwards - there is a good reason for that
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 4483
    • View Profile
    • DJ Paul Kononov
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #57 on: March 16, 2005, 04:53:31 PM »
when I have "number up store". Acceleration = Gradual increase of speed.

Acceleration <!> Speed is set and remains on value n

Acceleration only stops Accelerating when thouse things reach there absolute vilosity.

Offline Numsgil

  • Administrator
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 7725
    • View Profile
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #58 on: March 16, 2005, 05:00:30 PM »
That's not what the bots are doing.

In DB: when you store to .up you are creating an impulse.  Impulse = "Physics. The product obtained by multiplying the average value of a force by the time during which it acts. The impulse equals the change in momentum produced by the force in this time interval."

This impluse causes a change in acceleration.  Then .up is set back to 0 waiting for you to activate it again.

Think of the bots like this:

Each bot is a rocket ship.  When it maneuvers, it does so by short explosions that push it along (little a-bombs that explode against a blasting plate).  This results in a jerky accelerations, not a 'gradual increase in speed' at all.

If you want to keep accelerating at a constant value, you can program it in the DNA.

Offline Botsareus

  • Society makes it all backwards - there is a good reason for that
  • Bot God
  • *****
  • Posts: 4483
    • View Profile
    • DJ Paul Kononov
God doesn't play dice
« Reply #59 on: March 16, 2005, 05:08:18 PM »
http://s9.invisionfree.com/DarwinBots_Foru...ndpost&p=283764

Thats pusher bots stuff I was talking about.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2005, 05:08:43 PM by Botsareus »