Author Topic: Faster than light  (Read 26251 times)

Offline Botsareus

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« Reply #75 on: March 07, 2005, 07:28:27 PM »
btw I was never talking about an "ether" theory...

http://www.phys.vt.edu/~takeuchi/relativit.../section09.html
there, now thats what I was talking about in the lest 2 posts here.

 B) Btw Py how did you paste a picture? For example: I want to draw somthing in paint right now and post it, how would I do that? Is it even possible?  B)

 :ph43r: Bau :ph43r:
« Last Edit: March 07, 2005, 07:50:05 PM by Botsareus »

Offline PurpleYouko

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« Reply #76 on: March 08, 2005, 09:10:34 AM »
Quote
btw I was never talking about an "ether" theory...

http://www.phys.vt.edu/~takeuchi/relativit.../section09.html
there, now thats what I was talking about in the lest 2 posts here.

 B) Btw Py how did you paste a picture? For example: I want to draw somthing in paint right now and post it, how would I do that? Is it even possible?  B)

 :ph43r: Bau :ph43r:
You click on the button labelled "IMG" and paste or type in the URL to the picture that you want to display. This only works for web hosted pictures and not from your own PC.

something like this picture taken by the hubble space telescope.



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There are 10 kinds of people in the world
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Offline PurpleYouko

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« Reply #77 on: March 08, 2005, 09:20:08 AM »
Bots

What you have there in that link is a hypothetical situation predicted by relativity and passed off as fact.

This has been my problem all along.

Relativity predicts stuff but nobody has ever satisfactorily proven that it happens.

Your observer in the car has no real way to measure when the light beam hits either the front or back or the train so it can't be proven.

The observer on the train can't actually measure it either.

Besides which, a train doesn't move fast enough for there to be a measurable difference any way.

What if light is moving relative to its source rather than at a universal constant? It more or less explains the anomolies of the Michelson Moreley experiment.

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There are 10 kinds of people in the world
Those who understand binary.
and those who don't

:D PY :D

Offline Numsgil

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« Reply #78 on: March 08, 2005, 09:25:53 AM »
Any system that replaces relativity has got to explain:

1. Black holes.  Predicted by relativity (although Einstein hated the idea) have been seen (not the hole itself, but the xrays of excited particles entering the event horizon).

2.  Mercury's orbit.  See the link I posted earlier.

3.  Doplar shift of light from celestial bodies moving > c relative to us.

And a bunch of others.  My opinion:  if it looks like a duck, sounds like a duck, and smells like a duck.  It's probably a duck.

Bots, try image shack (google it).  They host images for free.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2005, 09:26:11 AM by Numsgil »

Offline Zelos

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« Reply #79 on: March 08, 2005, 11:43:25 AM »
why they abonded ether was that it wasent needed in the relativity, but if it had exist it would create friction in space, and there is no friction in space, thats why you just keep moving for ever unitel you hit something
When I have the eclipse cannon under my control there is nothing that can stop me from ruling the world. And I wont stop there. I will never stop conquering worlds through the universe. All the worlds in the universe will belong to me. All the species in on them will be my slaves. THE ENIRE UNIVERSE WILL BELONG TO ME AND EVERYTHING IN IT :evil: AND THERE IS NOTHING ANYONE OF you CAN DO TO STOP ME. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Offline Numsgil

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« Reply #80 on: March 08, 2005, 11:45:20 AM »
Ether had some funny properties.

It had to be very viscous (that's why the speed of light was so high) but frictionless to explain planetary movement.

Of course, it's not necessarily odder than relativity, but relativity does have a few observations on its side.

Offline PurpleYouko

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« Reply #81 on: March 08, 2005, 11:54:36 AM »
Forgot to check your site earlier Num.

Just went in and had a look. Very interesting stuff.

I totally agree that anything that replaces relativity has to explain all the things that relativity does. That is the nature of science. One theory surpasses another simply by explaining stuff a little better than the last one did.

I don't disagree that relativity explains a lot of stuff very well and I don't actually think it is wrong per se.

My objection is more to the attitude that surrounds it. There is a massive reluctance to entertain the notion that maybe something else can also explain stuff and maybe even do it better.
At the first sign of anyone suggesting such a thing, the defences come up and they set out to prove that Einstein was right.

I have seen it so many times.

The point is that when doing an experiment of any sort, you don't set out to prove your point. That is going into it with a biased frame of mind so answers that are borderline will be given the benefit of the doubt and some answers that could conceivably point the other way may be discarded as outliers.

To do real science, you have to be completely unbiased or the results will be meaningless

How many papers or web sites have you seen that are actively defending relativity. From my experience, most seem to do this. The researchers are so convinced that relativity is 100% correct that they become blinded to other possibilities.

Maybe they are right, at least most of the time, but then again maybe they are missing something else that explains it all even better.

For one thing, we know that relativity doesn't apply in all situations since it comes into direct conflict with QM in certain cases. It isn't the be all and end all of science.

It is a useful tool. Nothing more and nothing less.


Just because something looks like a duck, walks like a duck and sounds like a duck doesn't necessarily make it a duck.

Maybe it's a decoy and you are about to get shot through the head by an irate hunter.

 :D  PY  :D
There are 10 kinds of people in the world
Those who understand binary.
and those who don't

:D PY :D

Offline PurpleYouko

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« Reply #82 on: March 08, 2005, 01:55:44 PM »
Hey check this out.

Just googling around to try to find out a bit more about "emitter theory" and how it was disproved and came up with THIS which later led me to THIS

Interesting sites claiming to show the error in the MM ether experiment.

For those of you who enjoy MATH, go work through it to see if it makes sense. I can grasp the concept and it seems to go along with what I was trying to get at earlier, but as far as the equations go  :blink:
I might as well be reading chinese.

Math makes my brain hurt  :wacko:

 :D  PY  :D
There are 10 kinds of people in the world
Those who understand binary.
and those who don't

:D PY :D